Conquer Club

Need revisiting.

I normally play escalating, so I guess I never noticed it as much, but Im playing flat rate now and I am in the Southeast and I finally noticed it. The Southeast has a bonus of only 3. It takes 7 territories, have to guard it at 3 while the Southwest has 6 territories and has to guard 3 but gets a bonus of 4? The West, 4 territories guarding 2 while New England is 4 territories guarding 1 and gets 2. The Rockies at 6 and the Great Lakes at 8 seem a little more comparable to each other. You have to guard 5 spots with both, but it takes 3 more territories to get the Great Lakes, so this kinda makes sense.

If we are to leave the Rockies and Great Lakes alone, I think it makes sense to put the Southeast at least at 4, and maybe even consider a 5. If it is brought to a 5, then the West should probably be put at 3. Leave Southwest alone at 4. If we are to bring all bonuses down, I'd bring Southwest down to 3, New England to 1, Rockies to 5 and Great Lakes to 6 or 7.


Was there some odd motivation by the map maker to set the bonus up in this way. It just seems a bit strange to me.

Yes, it doesn't seem as fair as it could be, but could you post this complaint on the USA thread in Final Forge?

Ah, my bad, wrong spot. I suppose a mod could move it just the same, no?

Since the USA Map was one of the maps that was launched with the site, it does not have post in the Final Forge Grave Yard.


--Andy

State409c wrote:Need revisiting.

I normally play escalating, so I guess I never noticed it as much, but Im playing flat rate now and I am in the Southeast and I finally noticed it. The Southeast has a bonus of only 3. It takes 7 territories, have to guard it at 3 while the Southwest has 6 territories and has to guard 3 but gets a bonus of 4? The West, 4 territories guarding 2 while New England is 4 territories guarding 1 and gets 2. The Rockies at 6 and the Great Lakes at 8 seem a little more comparable to each other. You have to guard 5 spots with both, but it takes 3 more territories to get the Great Lakes, so this kinda makes sense.

If we are to leave the Rockies and Great Lakes alone, I think it makes sense to put the Southeast at least at 4, and maybe even consider a 5. If it is brought to a 5, then the West should probably be put at 3. Leave Southwest alone at 4. If we are to bring all bonuses down, I'd bring Southwest down to 3, New England to 1, Rockies to 5 and Great Lakes to 6 or 7.


Was there some odd motivation by the map maker to set the bonus up in this way. It just seems a bit strange to me.

I disagree on most counts -- New England and the West are analogous to Oceania and South America on Classic, for example -- but I do agree that the bonus for the Southeast seems a little odd. I think it should be 4. It is pretty hard to take and can be hard to hold. The Southwest is fair, because it has a fairly central position in the map, bordering 4 continents.

Why compare it to the original map for your reasoning? I've always felt like those bonuses weren't great either, but as they are the original, no use in making a thread about them.

The West is definitely worth more than the value of New England, on that map. I think a reasonable easy change would be to put the Southeast at 4 and New England at 1. I've played that map a fair amount and I can't remember a time I didn't get New England on either escalating or flat rate and not win the game. Looking at the current game I am in now, if I don't ally with the other guy (3 left), there is a very high likelihood that the current N England holder will win.

State409c wrote:Why compare it to the original map for your reasoning? I've always felt like those bonuses weren't great either, but as they are the original, no use in making a thread about them.

The West is definitely worth more than the value of New England, on that map. I think a reasonable easy change would be to put the Southeast at 4 and New England at 1. I've played that map a fair amount and I can't remember a time I didn't get New England on either escalating or flat rate and not win the game. Looking at the current game I am in now, if I don't ally with the other guy (3 left), there is a very high likelihood that the current N England holder will win.

I use Classic as an example because it is the same situation. New England only has 1 border, but it also borders a huge continent, making expanding from there quite difficult. On the other hand, the West has two borders, but it borders two continents, both easier to take and hold (though granted it's still pretty much impossible to hold the Rockies) than the Great Lakes. I think there's more room for debate for the West, though, since even the Southwest isn't an easy continent to take and hold, and holding the West with it doesn't really make holding it any easier (that is, Nevada is really the only territory you can hold that guards a border in both continents). It also has a more cornered position on the map, compared to South America in Classic. USA is not as circular as Classic, making it quite hard to get from New England to the West.

I do mostly agree that the bonuses are slightly off on the US map, but not to the degree that you claim. Basically, my only real beef is that the Southeast should be worth 4. I also would like to hear what people have to say about the West.