Power Role Draft Mafia - Town Wins!

[Djfireside]

Sorry...posted before I was finished...

Spiesr-also have no clue.

My list of suspects would be

Dj
Clever
Edoc

In that order.

Fast posted by dj...just to say it again..he posted all of my quotes EXCEPT the one where I questioned pmc on how he knew dj was town. Very convenient...once again.

Ill post the quote for you because you seemed to have forgotten it.... again. You can say you did something but dont give the reference

unvote

First off its a 3 way and I don't want all of them to have to claim so don't claim just yet.

Fast posted by pmc...sorry for the double post....but to clarify...i am on the road and posting from my phone. Which is not a small feat for my huge thumbs. Pmc...thats a pretty fast rush to judgement. If I were mafia...i would certainly try to conjure as many cases as I could if my attempt at a mass claim failed. After your epic waffling on ghostly...i think a definite pattern is emerging.

Fast posted again...but I don't have twenty more minutes to post.

Honestly I am quite good at being mafia, but I am not this good. I like to build cases, I still think ghostly is an ok lynch and has a decent chance of flipping scum but I didn't want to waste today and I doubt many people would claim that town are in a worse off position because of it. I build cases and I apply pressure, when I am inevitably night killed I hope to leave behind enough information to win. That is the pattern.

Now you have drunkmonkey and dj sitting in front of you and one must be the JOAT FYPOV, so who do you think it is?

I tried to give you an answer pmc...i will be in and out until sunday. I am on the fence and would like to hear from both players. On my list...djfireside is not clearly defined as town...not scummy either...but I dont have a bead on him at all. its worth mentioning that you (pmc) are basing a push to pressure the top 3 on this list. Do you have something that convimces you to put so much stock in dj?

PMC pressured you with a vote and thats about it. He repeated what I stated that the JOAT was above me. Stating that between Myself, You and Drunk one of us was the JOAT. You did the same thing you have done most of the game and anytime anything has come your way you try to deflect everything. He wasnt putting stock into me but rather going on what I was claiming and investigating it. At no point did he say I was town

In your post you tried to say you gave an answer but all you did was try to reverse the quote stating that he was mafia and founder around yourself in both quotes. There was Absolutely nothing gained from either of those statements

I tried to give you an answer pmc...i will be in and out until sunday. I am on the fence and would like to hear from both players.

You were obviously part of it too.

its worth mentioning that you (pmc) are basing a push to pressure the top 3 on this list.

Why isnt it? Its information and we were seeking out the JOAT and if there is possible information why wouldnt it be followed and why would you deflect it off so much unless you were trying to hide it.

I have posted against everything and even went back pulling data that you thought would help your case just to put all the facts out there because I have nothing to hide and this one that I got slammed for actually looks worse on you. All you have done was try to hide away and even when questioned pretend you werent.

[Djfireside]

and to those who think im scummy

Why is it that I am more scummy than alt? Because I claimed my own role after he claimed it. He claimed before me so what can I do about that, Lie? You say that I had no choice but to claim with him? There are other mafia members roles why couldnt I have just claimed those since I would have known them. There would be 2 left, unless my thoughts on ghostly are right and he is mafia and the last mafia member is a unique to mafia role so there are none left. So if I am right about that, then ALT has to be lying the same and he blundered in pulling ghostly into it. Otherwise there should be another role out there.

So if you pin a mafia member to the wall and there is nothing to fall back on, what role do you go with to try to skate away? The cop cause who wants to kill the cop.

All he has done is deflect and try to hide behind whatever he could find, be it a role or pushing pressure around to others and try to come forward with data and by putting out my thoughts you should know I would have thought of it if I was in the other position.

So to the 4 who are calling me scummy at least tell me why I am worse than all that I have pointed out about ALT.

[alt1978]

Maybe I played this wrong...maybe I overvalued the imoortance of cop to the town. Dj says I should have claimed cop day one when pressured? Is he right? I didn't think so but maybe. On day two...when he makes his fake list and puts it out there...i don't know if it's true or not. Dj could have been telling the truth. I had no scum tells on him at all. The whole game he had said nothing of substance. Either he was lying...or drunkmonkey was the joat. 50/50 shot...i had nothing on drunkmonkey either. Had I claimed...drunkmonkey woyld have been hung as the town double voter...and I would have been framed as the joat...a really sharp plan. But from my shoes... I couldn't claim until I felt drunkmonkey was innocent. Any claim before that and I dont see how I would not have lynched drunkmonkey. Again...maybe I was wrong. Maybe I should have claimed.

Just one more thing about dj's happy go lucky math from the day before...if he hangs me and is the joat..he can doctor protect himself and force the town to lynch him the following day. Best I can figure that makes 2 town for 1 mafia (three had I fallen for the trap of hanging drunkmonkey). To say this is 1 for 1 and good for town is a bit disingenuous.

[Djfireside]

I didnt say you should have claimed right there as I didnt either but you deflected away and acted as though you had nothing to do with the situation.

As for Doctor protecting with JOAT. You cant protect yourself at least in the majority of the games you have to protect someone else and cant protect yourself thats why I didnt even mention it knowing full well, even the JOAT will die if targetted since all protection roles theorectically would be out for that person.

So the math still works barring the outside busdriver.

[spiesr]

You say that I had no choice but to claim with him? There are other mafia members roles why couldnt I have just claimed those since I would have known them.

Because, someone is going to be lynched today in the search for the presumed scum JOAT. If we lynch the wrong person today we will keep going after the possible candidates for being the scum JOAT until we either find him or lose. You are unavoidably one of the top 3 or so candidates for being the scum JOAT. As such, if you are scum you will be lynched/vigged at some point. If you claim the role that one of your scum mates has then all you are doing is screwing that person out of the ability to ever claim it themselves. (Which would likely harm them at the probably inevitable late game mass claim.) Claiming something that isn't counter someone just widens the field of possible candidates to like three people instead of two, buying you like a day or so at best. Since we aren't at LYLO it seems doubtful that doing so would be worth the trouble it would cause for you scum partner.

Just one more thing about dj's happy go lucky math from the day before...if he hangs me and is the joat..he can doctor protect himself and force the town to lynch him the following day. Best I can figure that makes 2 town for 1 mafia (three had I fallen for the trap of hanging drunkmonkey). To say this is 1 for 1 and good for town is a bit disingenuous.

A doctor protection can not usually be used on yourself.

[pmchugh]

Pmc...i dont quite yet understand the yo-yo ing on ghostly. I feel like pmc demands answers but doesnt like giving them. One of the quotes that dj conveniently left out in his summary of what I had typed...was when I asked pmc if he had any info or reason to believe dj was town after pmc believed dj's claim about having picked Zthird and having joat at the top of the list. Pmc never answered my direct question. P Pmc should also explain the waffling on ghostly. Overall...believe his taking the lead seems town but would love to get him on the record for why he believed dj
at his word.

Well ghostly was my number 1 suspect but he started redeeming himself right when the hammer was coming near. I wasn't sure, is being indecisive a scum tell?

Also where did I say I believed any claim of dj's? Quote me.

[alt1978]

Pmc...no quote to be had...only the fact that you came after drunkmonkey and I for the joat claim and seemed to let dj off the hook as far as pressure goes. In fact you never said you believed dj's claim...however you were acting on it. That's why I was fishing for some kind of town tell you had on dj.
Indecision not a scum tell. If that's what it was...excellent. With the pushing ghostly to l-1 and pulling back you're vote once spiesr voted...i didnt know if you were wagon hunting.
Was your pulling the vote off ghostly coincidental...or did you find anything to note in spiesr's vote. If it was coinsidence...its probably me overanalyzing details again...but if you were trying to draw out a bandwagon vote and saw spiesr go...maybe that's a place to start after dj and I are lying in our impending graves. that's all I can think of to be helpful.

In response to dj...when you site evidence from day one saying I was scummy for not wanting to reveal my role...and then blatantly twist what I say into something completely of which it was not to support your case that I was avoiding claiming (saying that I suggested bottom to top claiming)...its hard for me to draw a differwnt conclusion than you wanting me to claim day 1 cop.

But I also feel now like i'm talking in circles.

[edocsil]

Blarg, shit show.

DJ, you realize you are calling the doublevoter a cheater? No one is allowed to talk during the day. So now we have to hang the cop or the joat, all assuming the vig isn't lying. IMO alt is slightly less scummy, as he had to go first and guess right, it would have been easier to do a CC. Small lead in my mind though. Good logic could increase your odds of guessing right, depending on what pick you got vs you list position. Dunno what to think of the cop/ghostly stuff.

Also, ragian is conveniently dead. Convenient that DJ does not confirm a townie.

Instead of lashing out ya coulda quoted your reasons.

Edoc voting dj actually makes me worry, I am highly suspicious of edoc at the moment.

Meh, I expect to not need to quote something that was said on the last page, more or less for this reason. It checks to see who is paying attention and who is just skimming the last page.

Also lashing out? Hardly. I have great potential to be a dick at times, and that certainly wasn't one of them. Also, you completely ignored my questions pmc, they were not aimed at you explicitly, but I expected any who further desired to call me scummy would have dealt with them.

Should I go against my own argument and champion a counter case vs Alt? How would that be productive? How would that help the town?

What gain or benefit does the town get from me splitting the vote here? I think DJ is the more scummy of the two, and we MUST hang one of them today. If you desire to level suspicions at me, answer that.

The questions don't make sense to me. I didn't like you taking our side as I find you suspicious, this makes me wonder why you are voting with me and if I am voting wrongly. I don't see how your questions are relevant to my point of view.

Are you kidding me pmc? You think I am your foe, ergo every time I make an action it has to run counter to your own action? And my questions are only relevant to a townie... I placed a vote without a page of logic, when you damn well knew my opinion on the mater. Then you twist the situation to try to make it look like I am a skimming noob scum who is BWing on the biggest case he can find when you know it is nothing of the sort.

Then I ask you to explain why my action was scummy, as it's the action of a townie - hanging the threats to the town, and you say "I don't get the question."

[pmchugh]

Man people sure are making things up today.

Edoc, I never said you voting dj was scummy. In fact I found it to be pro-town and that's why I was worried because based on previous play you were quite high on my fos list.

Alt, I actually misread nags posts before mine and thought he wasn't considering dj may be lying so I specifically pointed out that it was between 3 people and not 2:

unvote

First off its a 3 way and I don't want all of them to have to claim so don't claim just yet.

[edocsil]

Edoc, I never said you voting dj was scummy. In fact I found it to be pro-town and that's why I was worried because based on previous play you were quite high on my fos list.

Fair enough.

[everywhere116]

So.....anything else to talk about, or is it time for all of us to pick a side?

[Djfireside]

I think we have covered everything up until now unless . The only thing that comes off and strikes me weird about ALT's last statement is that I dont remember him ever stating that he agrees he is more than likely dead from this as I have been saying since I started this that no matter what I am dead. Only now that we have stated that the JOAT cant protect themselves does ALT come to the same conclusion as before he thought the JOAT could cover themselves. Little things add up in the end.

maybe that's a place to start after dj and I are lying in our impending graves. that's all I can think of to be helpful.

[Djfireside]

Since everything has pretty much been covered and you can reread all the that has been put up I leave one question since everything else has been exhausted. If ALT is the cop and he knew ghostly was innocent and ghostly went to L-1 and was pretty much going to be lynch before PMC pulled away... ALT made a single comment on ghostly that was obscure at best and thats it.
If I knew someone was innocent I sure as hell would have tried alot harder than that even if I ended up getting outted for it. What good would a cop be if they had information and didnt speak up?

[dazza2008]

I think we have covered everything up until now unless . The only thing that comes off and strikes me weird about ALT's last statement is that I dont remember him ever stating that he agrees he is more than likely dead from this as I have been saying since I started this that no matter what I am dead. Only now that we have stated that the JOAT cant protect themselves does ALT come to the same conclusion as before he thought the JOAT could cover themselves. Little things add up in the end.

maybe that's a place to start after dj and I are lying in our impending graves. that's all I can think of to be helpful.

I took that to mean if we lynch the cop then the other would be Vigged or lynched and if we got the scum then they would kill the cop.

I find comments lke these trying to twist things to help you case. Vote Djfireside. That is L-1

[Djfireside]

I was trying to leave work and thought of another thing and while you may think my comments are scum, some make sense and Im just trying to leave a trail.

I was thinking about the Night kills. Two in the bottom of the pack. Why the bottom of the pack? Everyone kinda looked at it and wondered why would you hit so far down on the list?

For a number 2 to get hit but not number 1 that would be strange but if ALT was innocent, why not hit the top person. Why leave them alone? The difference between 1 and 3 is that if I was scum hitting one wouldnt be a problem cause it wouldnt draw any attention. But if 1 is scum, then hitting two is out of the question because why wasnt number 1 hit.

Think about it is all I ask

[dazza2008]

I was trying to leave work and thought of another thing and while you may think my comments are scum, some make sense and Im just trying to leave a trail.

I was thinking about the Night kills. Two in the bottom of the pack. Why the bottom of the pack? Everyone kinda looked at it and wondered why would you hit so far down on the list?

For a number 2 to get hit but not number 1 that would be strange but if ALT was innocent, why not hit the top person. Why leave them alone? The difference between 1 and 3 is that if I was scum hitting one wouldnt be a problem cause it wouldnt draw any attention. But if 1 is scum, then hitting two is out of the question because why wasnt number 1 hit.

Think about it is all I ask

I think scum would have hit low on the list because other roles were likely to keep eyes on the top and protect them. I think it is like any game. In normal games it is risky for scum to hit the most experienced guys as they are likely to be protected and watched etc.

It is all pretty WIFOMy really. Anyway I have voted what I think is right.

[drunkmonkey]

I can't get a great read on either. One is lying, and doing a damn fine job at it. We're just running in circles now though. For every case I see where alt looks scummy, there's one where Dj looks just as scummy. There's really not any new information coming up anymore. If one of them was going to slip, they'd have done it by now. It's time to put an end to this...if we got the wrong one, hopefully the other doesn't wake up.

vote Djfireside

I hope we're right.

[Rodion]

Simplified vote count

ghostly447 - nagerous
alt1978 - Djfireside
Djfireside - alt1978, ghostly447, soundman, everywhere116, edocsil, dazza2008, drunkmonkey (LYNCH)

Not voting: pmchugh, some7hing clever, spiesr

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch!

If I missed your vote, please let me know and post it in red for future reference.

[Rodion]

The day started with fierce pressure on Ghostly. He was deemed the most scummy and had to claim roleblocker. When it looked like his lynch was imminent, PMC suggested that getting the vigilante instead was a better idea. As clues started to pile up, Soundman claimed vigilante and placed the blame on the JOAT. With DJ's claim that JOAT was ahead of his actual role in his draft list and both Alt and Monkey denying to be the JOAT, it became apparent that at least one of them had to be lying. Monkey quickly claimed doublevoter and seems to have proven it. At this point, Alt looked to be the scummiest and he had to claim the exact role of DJ in order to delay his impending doom. Alt knew it:

Well...actually in thinking about it i think know the answer to my previous question. Also...being a kentucky guy...i'm going to be getting my lucky tee shirt ready and prepping to sit in my lucky chair so that we can finally win this eighth national championship tonight. A loss tonight however would ensure that i'm in no condition to get on here...so I am going to go ahead with the claiming.

I am the cop.

Knowing he was in bad position, he summoned all his luck and threw a hail mary pass from his 30.

FANTASTIC TOUCHDOWN!!!

After seeing DJ counterclaim him, he knew he had struck gold. As people decided who told the truth between the two, having correctly guessed the role he had to claim became the swinging factor to seal DJ's fate and buy him more time.

Djfireside, town cop, has been lynched!

It is now Night 2. 72-hour deadline as we have holiday and weekend, but please try to send your night actions earlier so the game progresses faster!

[pmchugh]

Well played alt, rather worryingly thats two games in a row I have completely misread you

[Djfireside]

Well at least that is over, that was damn tiring trying to make you all see light in a dark room. GL Townies

[Rodion]

As dawn broke, all citizens hurried to the agora so they could continue their fight for survival. Many of them expected this to be a short day with Alt in the hotseat, but they realized it could be longer than expected as soon as they checked the two corpses.

alt1978, mafia JOAT, has been killed.

dazza2008, town busdriver, has been killed.

It is now Day 3. With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch!

[everywhere116]

My original plan was to speedlynch alt. We obviously can't do that any more, but we can sue him for damages. After all, you can always sue the dead. It's just very, very, very, very.......expensive.

[Some7hingCLEVER]

I THINK WE GOT one!!
throughout the game i have been keeping tabs on who i think is scummy and it hit me that i had my mind made up on everyone last night. except for edocsill. so i decided to use my power as i am town tracker so i tracked him to see what he was up to. and well well well , he visited dazzalast night and dazza is dead vote edocsil and if anyone has any other info on him please add cause i think he may be our mafia. i dont know if i should share my night one action or not so i wont unless im supposed to.

but my questions to edoc are

why did you visit dazza last night(what did he do that made you wanna visit him)?

what is your power(wouldnt ask this if dazza was still alive but since he is dead it is kinda important)?

[pmchugh]

Nice shot soundman, risky but nice.

I was particularly suspicious of edoc myself, so I certainly think he should claim his action. Also I would like to know who ghostly roleblocked and why.